Welcome back to our discussion of Animal, Vegetable, Miracle by Barbara Kingsolver. If you haven’t read the first discussion, you can find it here. Our discussions are pretty loose–I’ll start the discussion with my thoughts on the chapters that we are reading–in this case Chapters 6-10–and then we’ll continue the discussion in the comments. Last time we had some really good discussions. I think the direction will be slightly different this time because these chapters aren’t as ‘technical’. The first 3 chapters or so were full of great information on how our country eats and I had a lot of thoughts on that!
But the last few chapters that we’ve been reading have more to do with the actual eating locally and seasonally which leads to a different kind of discussion, in my opinion. I’m not so concerned with what foods to avoid (because if we’re eating seasonally and locally then we eat what we find that’s in season!) which we discussed last time, but rather how to source them and how to cook them! What do I mean about cooking them? The one thing that is hard for me to do is to experiment with food without a recipe. And recipes sometimes brings about spending more money on ingredients that I don’t have on hand. So it’s hard to be creative when you have seasonal produce and a meat. Or at least for me. So this is one area I need to get better at–experimenting with different seasonal recipes or finding substitutes for the more specialized ingredients. I mean, don’t get me wrong, I like to cook and to experiment, but coming up with a recipe with things that are in front of me is not my area of expertise. Or coming up with a substitute for an ingredient.
But more about the book. I liked that these few chapters dealt more with the actual eating and raising of food versus the first few chapters that dealt with why we should eat seasonally and locally. How do you feel about raising your own meat? We’ve raised meat birds before and they are messy! I would do it again but I want to be able to butcher them myself. We normally take them to a butcher who only charges something like $3-$4 per bird, but still. I think part of homesteading, for me, is to be able to be as self-sufficient as possible. Does this mean I do everything right 100% of the time? Nope. In fact, the Mister and I just had this discussion yesterday. I tend to get lazy and not plan ahead and then I’m starving! So I go for the quick grab items. Or go to the grocery store in town (which is NOT a good grocery store at all). So he and I were discussing that I need to come up with a plan for the week and purchase all that I need, hopefully at a farm market, and then it’s set for the week. No more running to town to the grocery store. If it isn’t on the meal plan for the week, oh well. I like this. I feel inspired by this.
I did have a couple of questions though and wanted to get your thoughts. First, what do you do, if you are eating seasonally and locally, when you go out to eat or go to someone’s house. According to the chapters we read, Kingsolver and her family were fortunate enough to have a chef as a personal friend and when they threw the birthday party, everything was seasonal and local. We’re not all that fortunate. I guess for me, I wouldn’t adhere to it that strictly. Of course if I was writing a book I probably wouldn’t go out to eat at all!! HAHA. But since I can’t afford a personal chef nor am I writing a book, I would be a little more loose on that end.
My second question comes in the form of the greenhouse grown tomatoes. I know technically they’re grown by a farmer but they’re greenhouse grown. Which I guess you do if you don’t have a long growing season. But then that begs the question, should you grow things that aren’t viable in your growing zone? But then I wouldn’t be able to grow my figs! Or think about a lemon tree! How about herbs grown inside! I think I’m just totally overthinking things now. But when I read the part about the tomatoes in the greenhouse, it just seemed weird to me how much of the tomatoes were grown inside versus outside (the farm was farther up North from me, but we can usually get a good growing season for tomatoes).
And the other thought or question that I had was about shopping locally. That’s great if you have the resources, and the businesses, to support it. But I don’t. Prices in my town are higher than average. And it’s the same stuff I can get at a big box retailer, or Amazon, but the prices are better. I wish I could support local stores more but either they’re not that great (see comment on grocery store above). Or they’re overpriced. OR they don’t have what I need anyway. Or they’re not open when I need something. Most stores are closed on Sundays here. Need a car battery? Not happening on Sunday. Need a table saw? We can order you one. Oh, you need it today? Well, I guess you’re driving 45 minutes to the closest Home Depot. Don’t get me wrong. I like our little town. It’s just not always conducive to the idea of only shopping locally. I do try to support it as much as possible, but it’s not always possible.
Oh! And what about that diner in Vermont? Swoon! If only that could be a possibility or reality for every small town. We are fortunate to be surrounded with a lot of farmers. I get my (raw) milk from a local dairy. We have a least 2 cheesemongers (is that what they’re called? They make their own cheeses and sell them locally). There are at least 2 ice cream stands locally that make their own ice cream. Well, one makes ice cream, milk, cream, etc. The other is an actual ice cream stand. Their ice cream sandwiches are to die for! Homemade ice cream sandwiched between two homemade chocolate chip cookies! Yum!
Kingsolver brings up a lot of good ‘food for thought’ in these few chapters. Raw milk. Making your own cheese. I teach a class on making cheese. I love it! But I get too lazy sometimes and don’t do it. I need to change that. She’s right. With only a few tools and a little bit of time, you can make most of the dairy products we use on the regular–cottage cheese, sour cream, ricotta, mozzarella, even buttermilk! Keeping a flock of egg layers is fairly easy. We mentioned meat birds above. Most of us grow some, if not all, of our own veg. We’re normally pretty crafty people too, in some form or other. So making our own food isn’t that big of a stretch for us.
And finally, if you recall from the last discussion, I only made it through Chapter 3 before discussing. So this time I finished all the way through Chapter 10! But I also had a couple of thoughts on the chapters I didn’t read from last time. Mostly about the mushrooms. I haven’t ever foraged for mushrooms, mostly because I am not an expert with them. And that can be a deadly game! But after reading about the morels, I did some research. I’m happy to report that we will be foraging for morels this spring. We should have plenty around as our area is prime for their growing conditions! I’m excited to add this to the list.
And I wanted to say sorry about all the pictures. The morning light was just too good when I took the pictures and I just couldn’t cull them down any! So lots of pictures this post! Okay. It’s your turn. Tell me all about your thoughts and ideas on these chapters. And don’t forget, here’s the rest of the reading/discussion schedule:
February 4, 2020: chapters 11-15
February 18, 2020: chapters 16-20 and wrap up
Bekah L Marten
I think (and I may be off base) that a major piece of their decision to eat locally and seasonally grown foods was to reduce their consumption of oil required to transport food to where they were….flying in grapes from Chile in January. So if someone could use a greenhouse to grow veggies on their farm off season or extend the season, it is not requiring the oil needed to transport food therefore it may be considered acceptable? But then again, the author talked about having to wait months for the first bite of fresh fruit. So maybe she contradicts herself a bit to have that bite of tomato š
There are a few contradictions throughout the book like this. I think it is just another good example that you cannot always have such clearly defined black and white rules in life. There are always gray areas with stuff like this. It is difficult to pull off those legalistic rules…you would miss out on the joys of life, like a meal with friends that may or may not be filled with seasonal and/or local foods.
Just my two cents. I’ll pop by later and add more to the discussion. I’ve gotta run!
Tracy
Hi Bekah – I just posted a comment with my initial thoughts on these chapters, but it’s being “held in moderation – awaiting approval” here (unusual), so bummer. I wonder if this comment will require approval, too?
But I wanted to respond to your comment: “…you cannot always have such clearly defined black and white rules in life. There are always gray areas with stuff like this. It is difficult to pull off those legalistic rulesā¦you would miss out on the joys of life, like a meal with friends that may or may not be filled with seasonal and/or local foods.”
I could not agree more. While I think principles are important to honor, there is a grey area. One, friends don’t always share the same principles, and two, it’s not always our place to expect them to switch to ours.
And yes, the energy cost of food transportation is a big issue (and rightly so) in Kingsolver’s book. It’s impact on the environment and the cost of nutritional value on the transported food all play into her food choices. So I think she’d agree that growing a lemon tree (for example) would be just fine if one could pull that off in a colder climate! š
chickenlibrarian
I’m not sure why the blog does that with comments. It happens on occasion but thankfully I’m an obsessive comment checker so I catch it pretty quickly. LOL.
Agreed about the gray area and also about not expecting our friends and family to change their preferences and/or principles to match ours, but at the same time isn’t that what we’re talking about? And Kingsolver is too? Isn’t she saying if you change your preferences and expectations and principles to eat more seasonally and locally then our oil consumption will be reduced, we’ll be a healthier nation, etc?
Just food for thought. gotta run. Will check back in soon. I owe you a response to your comment Tracy!!
xox
-k
chickenlibrarian
Oh, good points Bekah. I guess that’s kind of what I was thinking…there are a few contradictions like this. But I guess if your goal is to reduce oil consumption then growing in a greenhouse is acceptable. I totally think growing in a greenhouse is acceptable and something I plan to do (I wish I had a greenhouse now)…it was just the contradiction in the book. And yes to ‘there are always gray areas in life’. I am definitely not one of those staunch it’s either this or that, not both. Well, for most things anyway. š
Tracy
Hello all! So glad this was posted today, as I have off from work and have time to comment. Iām going to share my thoughts and respond to a couple of Kristinās questions with my viewpoint. No particular order, here!
It was nice to move into more of a āstoryā with this next set of chapters. Kingsolverās slice of life with regards to Lily and her chickens was priceless. āIf I love my chickens six, I love you seven,ā says Lily. š Additionally, I was really intrigued by the childās reversal on her chickens and the decision to sell meat birds (even if they were only supposed to be the āmean onesā) following her research on profit and her desire for a horse. I have no opinion on that, I just thought it was interesting commentary on being human and balancing how we view other life-forms ā and how that can change dependent upon our desires (or needs). Did anyone else think about that when they read chapter six?
This leads to one of Kristinās questions: How do you feel about raising your own meat?
I have absolutely nothing against people / families ethically / responsibly raising their own meat. I think itās important for people to understand (and children to learn) where their food comes from ā especially when it comes to ending an animalās life. Hamburgers do not come from the grocery store. Hamburgers come from a cow. Chicken wings do not come from the pizza shopā¦ they come from a chicken. Having said that, do I want to raise my own meat, slaughter it, butcher it, and then store it and eat it? In the most academic sense of entertaining an idea, yes. In practice am I going to do that? No. Even chickens ā which would be the most realistic animal for us to raise here for meat ā are not on my radar for meat harvesting.
Now let me ask a question that Iāve been meaning to toss out there for discussion: What if you believe your wonderful, local resource for beef might (MIGHT) be selling some of their calves to a CAFO states away? This is a āmight beā scenario, not a known scenario. Would you continue to buy from them? After all, the meat you are being is locally raised, well cared for, and is slaughtered / butchered / packaged locally for sale direct to consumers. Just something for discussionā¦
Chapter eightās section on pricing ā Iāve seen price reductions reflected in my grocery bill since organics continue to become more readily available. Organic chicken is very affordable at my market ā the ālesserā cuts: thighs, legs, and whole chickens (less āconvenientā for some shoppers). So are certain beef products. I do believe the more we āvote with our dollarā ā buying the good food versus the boxed āfoodā or cheap-and-shipped-so-many-miles-nutrient-poor produce, the more affordable and widespread good food will become. By the way, I am a buyer of non-organic but locally, responsibly grown / raised food. It doesnāt have to be organic to be a good choice.
Smart investment: Good, real food + healthier choices = good future / good life.
Loving to cook makes it so much easier. And I donāt have children, which means I donāt have the responsibility of getting people to and fro while limiting time spent in the kitchen. But you know what? I know people who DO have kids, and still eat well and actuallyā¦ COOK. Egads! Children and home cooking? What magic is afoot here?
š Those parents I see managing such a full schedule have this in common: planning plus prioritizing their kidsā health (mental and physical). Which chapter was it that Kingsolver points out the strangeness of getting kids to a sports practice (for health / physical exercise) and yet feeding them often on the way with fast food takeout?
Another Kristin question: What do you do, if you are eating seasonally and locally, when you go out to eat or go to someoneās house?
Iām guessing this isnāt a weekly occurrence, but even if it was, I would say thank you and enjoy the meal that friend made and invited me to! Unless I had a food allergy, Iād simply eat what was given to me. Iād also consider inviting my friends over to my house for a super delicious dinner, cooked in season and locally sourced as much as possible.
Another Kristin question: Should you grow things that arenāt viable in your growing zone?
I guess my question in response would be, well, why not? So many of our ālocalā produce was not originally native to where we live (here in the US). Think potatoes. Think tomatoes. Two basic ingredients of so many of our dishes. Birds spread seed when consumed in one area and pooped in another. People spread seed by carrying and shipping.
As long as you are not introducing a plant species into an area and letting it loose to dominate and crowd out your ānativeā plants, I advocate for growing what you can, where you can, and working to make it as healthy and stable as possible.
If I could successfully grow garbanzo beans en masse here where I live, you bet your bottom I would!
Funny you should mention lemon trees, Kristinā¦ I was just thinking about researching how to successfully grow small lemon trees indoors here ā not a priority, but something to look into āfor funā that could be beneficial. After all, canning and lemon juice go hand in hand.
And herbs inside? I absolutely grow what I can. Iām getting ready to plant a new batch. Which, sidebar, so you know how challenging it is to find French Tarragon seed? Itās mostly Russian Tarragon seed on the market. Oh, I found one source for French Tarragon, but the shipping is $9. Iām a little annoyed by that, so I havenāt ordered it yet. Also, I read that technically, French Tarragon is not grown from seed, but from cuttings. Soā¦ well, I digress.
Shopping locally: definitely a challenge when you are in an area without a lot of options. Keep in mind that even with a lot of options, ticket price at the local shop is often higher. I think it comes down to priorities and planning. We do our big errand day on Saturday (harder in late spring in summer when we have to be in the garden) and thatās a 30-minute drive one-way for the grocery store alone. But, we do all of our shopping on that one trip: groceries, Loweās if necessary, local shops if necessary, etc. Thereās a Farmers Market on Saturdays in the same town ā every other Saturday in winter.
I believe that sometimes you have to pare down your shopping list if you want to be more local. What trade-offs are you willing to make? Hereās a better question: what IS available that youāve never eaten that you CAN easily source and enjoy? I never ate a turnip or a parsnip until I met my husband. Turnips in particular are common in winter farmers markets (that Iāve seen) and are SO GOOD. What else is available now that you can get and make?
I honestly believe if you focus on growing as much as a variety of things you can in your garden and put up as much as you can, it is so much easier to āeat localā more often. Just this past week, spread across multiple days, our homegrown veggies included: beets, zucchini, carrots, green beans, and corn. We also eat pickled veggies from our garden that we canned: cucumbers, celery, peppers (with the sweet pickle chunks), tomatoes. Our stock for chicken soup included frozen celery leaves for flavor and Thyme from my kitchen window. Our pasta sauce was made with our tomatoes. Did we add things like salt and pepper? Various ānot localā spices in the pasta sauce? Of course. But, our efforts are worthy even if āeverythingā is not local. Itās about taking steps, not winning the race.
Okay, time for me to wrap-up with these two items:
1. Itās about taking steps, notā¦ naked and afraid. (I donāt know where THAT came from, I donāt watch that show, but you get my drift.) Aim for local, make it a priority, but donāt fall into a feast or famine trap: Itās just not a sustainable or reasonable practice for pretty much any of us.
2. What you CAN do: Plan plan planā¦ Thatās one of the most important take-a-ways not only from this book, but really, in general. The good advice in life is: plan it.
Plan your gardens. Plan your care of them. Develop a schedule and a routine. Be flexible, but donāt go in without a plan. Food? How to eat? Plan your upcoming menus. Plan your time. Plan your shopping list. Shop your pantry first. Plan your travels / errands so that they make sense. If you develop the plan, the rest is easier.
I use as many tools as necessary to plan the work and work the plan: a printed 2020 planner; an Excel spreadsheet for budgeting ā with a budget usually forecasting the next six months; my Alexaās shopping list; my grocery storeās online shopping list tool (great for developing a list on a budget); and a various assortment of to-do lists, journal entries, and calendar notes. (Tip: also, keep a running inventory on the food you have stored ā again, makes it easier to plan menus and spend your food budget more efficiently.)
The more disciplined I am on planning and sticking to it, the greater my food pleasure and the meeting of my ālocal sourcingā goals. š
chickenlibrarian
Well said Tracy! My apologies for taking so long to respond. You gave us some good food-for-thought. I’m not sure how to follow this up with anything other than, “YASS” and “Well said”. I totally agree about planning being a very important part of eating seasonally, eating locally, and/or eating healthy. I know that’s ALWAYS my downfall…not planning properly. I’m sure I’ve mentioned it time and time again. It’s so important to sit down with a piece of paper and write out what you are eating for the week and then make a shopping list from that menu plan. Or at least for me it’s important to put pen to paper. Some people may prefer their device to keep track of that stuff. But I’m old fashioned in pen and paper. Or pencil and paper. But I digress. In theory, I would be shopping my pantry and freezer and then using the farm market or local stand to fill in the gaps. And THEN using a good grocery store to stock up on any missing staples, such as flour, sugar, spices, etc. etc.
As for the growing of ‘exotics’ like lemon trees (I never really thought of it as an exotic until now. LOL), I agree that it would be considered local once you have it at your house and are growing it. I’m glad we talked that through though! Because I would be awful sad without my avocado tree (that will probably never produce, but I love her anyway) and my fig tree. And the potential for a Meyer lemon tree and who knows what else. Not that it would have mattered anyway. I would have still grown these things. I think anytime you are growing things on your own, as long as it’s not an invasive species as you mentioned Tracy, it’s all good. You’re growing it yourself. Although I think this is the year I really start focusing on the heirloom garden. I have some of those seed catalogs waiting for me at home (thank you for mentioning them! Did I thank you for my new obsession? HEHE).
As for your question about my local meat source selling to a CAFO? That’s a tough one. On the one hand, is this how their farm is surviving? I can’t fault them for doing what they need to do in order to survive…especially if they are raising that meat animal in such a way that is humane and sustainable (i.e. it’s not a food lot situation. Of course, if it were a food lot situation, I wouldn’t be buying my meat from them anyway). So I guess my answer would be centered around that. I know my farmers that I buy my meat from. I’ve known them for YEARS. So I think I would still support them and hope they continue to farm because I want to see small farms survive. That’s my answer I guess. Is it popular opinion? I don’t know. Probably not.
What else. I’m not sure except I can’t stress the planning and goal setting part enough. That’s what I need to focus on more. Taking the time, menu planning, setting goals-both big and small.
Okay. Until next time. Gotta run! Thanks for all this food-for-thought ladies!!
xoxo
-k